Instagram post by @topvelocity ⚾️🔥💯 Snapchat : topvelocity

ALERT: Another Weighted Baseball Study Just Launched Showing the High Risk of Injury Especially with the Balls Over 6oz. This is 1st Study to use Balls Over 20% of 5oz. The study also warns against the effects of weighted baseballs on hurting pitch accuracy. #weightedballs #weightedbaseballs #pitching #pitchinginjury #pitchingscience #runandguns #longtossing #baseball

44 Comments

  • 49w ago buckypage buckypage

    @cameronallen_ they’re also grown men

  • 49w ago sklov27 sklov27

    @cameronallen_ in what way have they used them? Warm up or run and guns?

  • 49w ago luckyluc1321 luckyluc1321

    I hate it when I see these pitching gurus on IG using weighted ball tricks. They are setting up these kids... kids for shoulder instability/injuries

  • 49w ago coach_mayyys coach_mayyys

    Why is a baseball 5oz?

  • 49w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @coach_mayyys why is the sky blue?

  • 49w ago fastarmcare fastarmcare

    Honest question...why do you feel the need to demonize what other people do on a constant, almost daily basis? Why not just prop up and promote your own program and its benefits? Rarely do I see you post anything that shows the success your players are having.

  • 49w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @fastarmcare I post often the success of my players. Look in my insta live. I tore my rotator cuff at 18 because of coaches with your mentality that you should not provide all the information on the risk of training to your students. If the money is good who cares about the injury. This ignorance almost destroyed my career. My purpose is educating against extreme throwing programs that are causing high risk of injury because I can’t stand to stay in this industry and watch this mentality continue to ruin careers.

  • 49w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @fastarmcare in other words. Why are you showing people third party studies that weighted balls has a high risk of injury? We use it with our athletes and don't care that the evidence is coming out that we were wrong... Cody Hall, Alhanon Miller, JJ Dunn, Connor Cosse, Jeremy wei have all been massively successful testimonials we have posted about. I don't see anybody else telling the truth about weighted balls and there is no arguing that is the most popular form of velocity training right now. Only problem is small results on avg 2-3 mph and lots of injury.

  • 49w ago cameronallen_ cameronallen_

    @sklov27 Both, and either way this post says warm ups too. So picking one up at all is harmful apparently?

  • 49w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @cameronallen_ I guess science is bad when it doesn’t support your approach.

  • 49w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @cameronallen_ The main reason people want to use weighted balls is to increase velocity, but you can't use elites in the games as examples to use them. Most of there velocity came from their genetics: height, weight, limb length, CNS, muscle fiber type etc. Weighted balls didn't make them who they are. If you want to pitch like them you need to move like them. Only way to do that is developing to a similar level (or getting as close as possible) of athleticism and biomechanics.

  • 49w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @cameronallen_ as far as using them as warmups. Swinging an overweight bat doesn't increase swing velocity. I would need studies, but I don't think warming up with an overweight ball increases throwing velocity. So, even if there is no injury risk for warm ups it wouldn't give you any real edge.

  • 49w ago marlintat05 marlintat05

    Former college pitching coach weighing. I feel Pitchers who are athletic and willing to work hard are going to increase velo during their 17-22 age range regardless of whether or not they use weighted balls provided they are strength training correctly. I do think there is some merit to weighted balls but to what degree I'm not sure. I had one driveline pitcher and he had quite a large jump in velo the year I had him. For that individual I would say the weighted ball program was successful. On the other hand. Pitching requires "feel" and I fear that overuse of weighted balls may contribute to less accuracy. That is strictly opinion no data. One last thing. Pitchers are definitely throwing harder as a whole but also radar guns are reading higher than ever. The stalker 2 can read anywhere from 2-4 miles faster at high speeds than the old stalker

  • 49w ago mattmarksberry mattmarksberry

    Damn you're butt hurting a lot of people today haha

  • 49w ago fastarmcare fastarmcare

    @topvelocity whoa, when did I ever say my mentality was to not provide information? You’re putting words in my mouth and that’s disingenuous. I was asking a serious question because I see your insta posts and lately they are all demonizing weighted balls, even your sponsored Facebook posts do the same. I rarely see you showing off your program or congratulating your successes.

  • 49w ago fastarmcare fastarmcare

    @stevenguadagni you speak of weighted balls like it’s the grassy knoll conspiracy theory. I think most people understand that there are inherent risks when training with weighted implements. There are inherent risks when lifting weights too. I’m not trying to get into a pissing match with anyone, I had a genuine interest in the answer.

  • 49w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @fastarmcare we gave you a genuine answer. We don't use weighted balls with our athletes because of small avg returns on velocity and high risk of injury. Third party studies and anecdotal evidence support this. We post about our athletes success all the time. I gave you 5 recent examples. I don't want pissing matches either. I just get annoyed when we present third party studies proving our point and what feels like every coach in America saying that we are just trying to demonize weighted balls.

  • 49w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @fastarmcare you are cherry picking what you want to see. Just look on my Instagram posts. You will find a wide range of information on my training.

  • 49w ago fastarmcare fastarmcare

    Probably because 3 of the last 5 insta posts and your sponsored Facebook ad are about the negatives of weighted ball training. Maybe just been overly saturated with it lately.

  • 49w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @fastarmcare I hear you, but like I said, it's the most popular form of training and it feels like we are the only ones trying to speak out about it. If you are the only one you gotta be loud or you will be drowned out by all the other voices. It's not like all of our posts are made up. It is 3rd party studies and anecdotal evidence. Somebody has to tell it how it is and Brent has gone against a whole industry on it and hasn't wavered. Hats off to him.

  • 49w ago randystreet randystreet

    @marlintat05 Coach, I have some personal experience with radar guns myself. Oddly enough, I checked out several models and found most of them are all over the place. My Stalker Sport 2 actually reads about 2 mph less than the Pocket Radar and Stalker Pro, for instance. Everyone needs to check the guns with tuning forks to make sure they are reading accurately. Cheap and takes about 30 seconds. People get upset when the numbers are low and you pull out a tuning fork and check the calibration right there! Lastly, cosangle errors affect radar guns, as does movement (gun on a tripod will be more accurate than held by hand). Off topic a bit (sorry) but All still important

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    Then why is Kyle Boddy a millionaire? And why does almost everyone else support the use of them? Are you suggesting you’re more knowledgeable than everyone else in the industry, and that your analysis is correct and everyone else’s isn’t? Cmon, man..

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance I am suggest you read the science because we have a problem. Not just DL but everyone in baseball is making money on weighted balls, I am sure you are one of them, and we have tons and tons of young kids ending their careers with them. You common on and tell me why I have so many people reaching out to me about how they injured themselves on high intent weighted baseball training?

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity more then likely, it’s because with bad mechanics, weighted baseball training is dangerous. They come to you, and you blame weighted baseballs, but in reality it’s the equivalent of lifting with bad form. If you deadlift with a massive back arch, you will hurt your back. It’s not the weight, it’s the form/mechanics. I believe the same applies to weighted baseballs. I assure you it wasn’t a rocket scientist who determined that a baseball should weight 5 oz. if it weighed 6, or 7, or 8, how would this discussion be any different? As Eric Cressey says, “who determined a baseball should be 5 ounces?”... I just think that we’re over analyzing this argument, when in reality we should be focused on fixing mechanics, and then using those proper mechanics to incorporate weighted balls, etc.. into their training. Sorry if that came off as insulting, I respect you Brent.

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance I understand your position. Technique and supervision makes lifting and weighted baseball training safer. The problem is this doesn’t change the statistics on Injury. Olympic lifting for example has a Lower injury rate than The MLB and weighted baseball training has more injury than training with a regular baseball. Therefore we can not compare Olympic lifting or weight lifting injury to weighted ball training. Even if supervised the probability of injury and serious injury for that matter is higher. It doesn’t matter the weight of the regulation baseball the fact is that is the weight that baseball has made the standard and amount of games played per week and pitching rotations have built around this standard. This means if you change the standard weight the the amount of innings pitched and games played will change because the sport will be forced too to keep everyone healthy.

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity this isn’t based off any statistics, but I’ve seen many more kids with tweaks, and small injuries by doing Olympic lifting, than I have with weighted baseball training. I understand your philosophy and I believe we’ve fallen way too in-love with weighted balls, but I also think your full blown attack of them is a little bit unwarranted and kind of incorrect. I certainly think they have a time and a place for being used.

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance I have been the advocate against weighted baseball high intent training sense it got popular after the Steve Delabar HBO series. This means I get the calls. Once a week from parents players either injured or having surgery from throwing the balls or just following the season they first implemented them. Worse than that listen to the stories in my interview of Noah and Trent and all of the comments on the page on my site with all the stats. I have also lifted with the Olympic lifts for 20+ years as a pro athlete and trained thousands of pitchers with them for over 10+ years and have little to zero injury. Hearing you claim you have injury from Olympic lifting makes no sense the me but I am not supervising your training.

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity you’ve never had one athlete tweak an elbow or knee performing cleans, jerks, etc? No way that’s true. It happens to people, from the youth level to professional competitors who have absolutely perfect form, and know a lot more about training than either of us.

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity there’s a lot you don’t know Brent. Heck, in your YouTube video you practically accused Alex Reyes of being on steroids because your couldn’t figure out why he throws 100 Mph. Seriously?

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance I am not talking strains or brushes. This happens in everyday life. I am talking tears, breaks and dislocations.

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance I have a source that has evidence he was on a PED.

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity I’ve never had a tear or break in lifting either. You made it sound like you’ve never had so much as a tweak from lifting. I just don’t see any top velocity atheltes who are having much success in the major leagues. I see WAY more superstar pitchers that use weighted baseballs, than I do training with your methods.

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance yeah weighted baseball is what made then superstars and you say I don’t know what I am talking about. You have a serious flaw in your logic here. If weighted baseballs equal superstar baseball player then why do the thousands of others who use it either get seriously injured or never make it or of high school?

  • 48w ago ic_sports_performance ic_sports_performance

    @topvelocity nowhere did I say that the weighted baseballs made them superstars. Simply stating that the best of the best seem to think they’re of good use, yet you totally discredit them.

  • 48w ago topvelocity topvelocity

    @ic_sports_performance seems to me most of them are using them as a warmup and not in high intent Velocity training which is what the debate is really about. Once again we have studies and tons of anecdotal evidence showing high risk of injury.

  • 48w ago yaokay4321 yaokay4321

    @stevenguadagni driveline baseball use weighted balls and bats and really implement the use of it. Thoughts?

  • 48w ago yaokay4321 yaokay4321

    @stevenguadagni also, they have a program using overload and underload bats which does increase bat speed

  • 48w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @yaokay4321 I said as a warm up. Overload and underload bats do increase bat speed over a 6 week period or so. Not as a warm up. And there is no pattern of injury with swinging a bat. So, I'm all for swinging under and overload bats. Studies also show weighted balls over a period do of time, but there is a pattern of injury so I don't like the use of them.

  • 48w ago yaokay4321 yaokay4321

    @stevenguadagni personally, i think that the main reason why weighted balls cause injuries is due to the fact that a) players are not at their optimal strength to throw them and b) coaches make up a whole program which only includes max velo throwing only and not “ramping” the player to get their arm prepared for “run and guns”, etc. Also, do you support plyro balls as well?

  • 48w ago stevenguadagni stevenguadagni

    @yaokay4321 No, we don't use any plyo balls. I don't think any program has a safe approach to weighted balls even with an "optimal strength" and "ramping" program.

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